SBayGirl
25.09.2007, 11:12 |
unscented products (Hair & Scalp Odor Problem) |
Hi, I am new to the board. Been suffering from scalp odor for a month, or at least for a month it's gotten so bad, people are whispering to each other about the odor. If I smelled previously, it wasn't so bad as now.
I have been experimenting with different shampoos. Each one gives me a different odor. It makes me think that there's something about the fragrance. Maybe we find most fragrances toxic and our bodies try to excrete it through our oils.
I came upon this idea after using Neutrogena T/Sal. It has salicylic acid to control scalp oil, but it's also unscented. There was virtually no smell, but then I noticed the other bad smell from the laundry fabric softener. So I did laundry with no fabric softener--liquid or dryer sheet. Much better, but then I noticed a funky scent at the back of my head. It's where I washed with soap to clean my neck. So today I'm trying a non-scented soap.
If this works, maybe we all have fragrance intolerance and fragrance-free products are our solution. I am hoping this is my solution. Maybe it could be yours, too.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
01.10.2007, 10:51
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
OK, so deleting all fragrance helped to an extent, but I still gave off some weird gas--odorless to a weird chemical citrus smell. I was on the Nuvaring, so I stopped that. I wonder if my body is reacting to the synthetic hormone.
The other thing is that I have been so stressed out from this ordeal that my diet has been terrible. In fact, my diet was terrible even before this began, so my friend thinks I'm going through ketoacidosis since I have been barely eating and lost 10 lbs. in a month.
So I'm seeing a doctor today and hope to get to the bottom of this weird odor.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
ginawat
01.10.2007, 10:57
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
» OK, so deleting all fragrance helped to an extent, but I still gave off
» some weird gas--odorless to a weird chemical citrus smell. I was on the
» Nuvaring, so I stopped that. I wonder if my body is reacting to the
» synthetic hormone.
»
» The other thing is that I have been so stressed out from this ordeal that
» my diet has been terrible. In fact, my diet was terrible even before this
» began, so my friend thinks I'm going through ketoacidosis since I have
» been barely eating and lost 10 lbs. in a month.
»
» So I'm seeing a doctor today and hope to get to the bottom of this weird
» odor.
Please keep us posted
ginawat is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
02.10.2007, 13:51
@ ginawat
|
unscented products |
My doctor thinks it's psychosomatic. She thinks the stress triggered everything. It's possible, but I notice that after changing my diet--making sure I eat three balanced meals a day--seemed to work wonders on my odor within 2 days. (At the same time, I've been off the Nuvaring for a week.) I still think it was a combination of ketoacidosis--my body releasing ketones into the air because I was burning muscle--and something to do with my body's reaction to synthetic hormones.
In any case, yesterday I was relieved there was no smell. I will have to conduct further investigations later to see if fragrance triggered a stress response in my body, but for now I'll keep it fragrance-free. I'll conduct my experiments on the weekends.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
05.10.2007, 17:47
(edited by SBayGirl, 05.10.2007, 19:41)
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
So I'm back to an odor problem. That same chemical citrus scent! Later when I skipped dinner, I got an awful sweet scent. In my desperation, I tried Jason's Dandruff Shampoo, but I smell horribly like sulfur and an unwashed musky scent. I can't smell like that in class!
So I'm back to thinking about either fragrance as the problem or possibly synthetic hormones. Have any of you found that hormone imbalance was the cause of your odor? Like becoming pregnant, taking birth control pills, etc.? Did any of you suffer weight loss and found that you had odor because of that?
Did more research online and found this wonderful journal article:
http://aem.asm.org/cgi/reprint/38/3/412.pdf
Looks like our scalp yeast has taken over our whole scalp. I'm looking into treatments for Pityrosporum ovale. I think this is why we are experiencing this problem. When we are stressed, take synthetic hormones, pregnant, generally unwell/not healthy, our bodies which house bacteria, fungi, and yeasts which are normally in balance, go totally out of balance. I'm guessing that the yeast on our scalps have overgrown all the other microorganisms. I'm going to look into shampoos that combat this yeast problem.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
08.10.2007, 14:30
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
So I decided to try using the Jason's Anti-Dandruff Shampoo for 3 days during the weekend. As I said, the 1st day was awful. The second day was better in that the sulfurous smell was a little better. I still had the weird musky smell. Then the 3rd day was a little better, but I still had the musky smell. So I decided to try using Nizoral which is the best for yeast control. It had a more pleasant smell after washing my head, so I'll continue with that.
My conclusion after reading scientific journal articles such as this one
http://home.comcast.net/~johnlabows/Axillary%20odor%20determination,%20formation&control.pdf
is that the odor is caused by either bacteria or yeast on our scalps that became imbalanced due to a surge of hormones or stress. These bacteria or yeast give off a gas that causes the odor.
I also think that I might have fragrance conflict with some of the shampoos on the market, such as the Jason's shampoo. That causes the weird musky scent. Changing to a different shampoo or fragrance-free product altogether should help.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
Betsy
09.10.2007, 09:08
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
Hi SBayGirl,
I am totally in agreement with you as to when you first use the Jason Dandruff Shampoo you smell sulfur, and as you use it more you smell Sulfur less and less. I have been using it for over a year now and I must say that when I use it now I don't smell sulfur at all. I love the smell I get from the Jason Dandruff. Maybe it takes a few washings to get the yucky yeasty bacterial buildup totally out of your hair. I also agree that certain scents make your scalp smell horrible. The worst my scalp ever smelled was with Panteen which I used years ago. That is when I first noticed the smelly scalp odor. Jason keeps my scalp smelling good all the time. I use it at least once a week and in between I use other sls, sles free shampoos.
I really like Aubrey Organics shampoos. The best one for me is the Calaguala Fern shampoo and it doesn't have much scent at all. But I've been experimenting with shampoo bars as well. Ligett's Old Fashioned Bar shampoo is a good one to try. But I find I need to use Jason Dandruff a little more often with Liggett's so I still favor the Aubrey Organics for variety. Don't know why this is except maybe it is a little more cleansing for my scalp. Jury is still out on this though.
I'm thinking that over time, the healthy sls, sles free shampoos are going to be the norm. Seems like there are an awfully lot of us who are running into problems with the standard, grocery store brand of shampoos.
Keep us all informed of your progress... 
Betsy is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
10.10.2007, 13:57
(edited by SBayGirl, 10.10.2007, 15:44)
@ Betsy
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unscented products |
I'm not entirely convinced that it has to do with SLS. I seem to be combating a fragrance problem, especially citrus. I cannot use anything with citrus fragrance or even citric acid. I ended up finally using Dove fragrance-free soap for my body. I am still working on the shampoo for my hair, but so far Earth Science Fragrance-Free shampoo is OK, though not great. There is no SLS in it, but there is SMS.
I might try the Aubrey Organics if there is a fragrance-free product. I noticed there is a Jason's product that is fragrance-free as well. Maybe some of us are dealing with a fragrance problem, and some of us are dealing with SLS? I don't know since I'm just starting my journey on this issue. It could be that you are right, and it comes down to SLS products.
I noticed my hair was like straw after trying so many shampoos. My skin was dry, too. My hands smelled strangely metallic after washing my hands with bar soap. I rubbed lotion on my hands, and the metallic smell went away. It got me wondering if that's what the smell problem was--my dry hair.
I was in Mexico swimming every day for 10 days in the summer. The chlorine and salt water must have stripped my scalp and hair of all moisture. Maybe the shampoo scent stays in my hair because it's so dry, it holds on to the smell for days. When I shampooed with the Jason Dandruff shampoo, the sulfur smell was in my hair for a long time, even though I had stopped shampooing with it. If you think about it, if you have diarrhea for a long time, you lose valuable ions. Similarly, if your hair is stripped, maybe it holds on to molecules from your shampoo, keeping the scent for a long time.
My scalp smells better lately, but I had been using Neutrogena T/Sal for two days, followed by Jason's Dandruff shampoo for three days, followed by Nizoral A-D for one day, then Earth Science fragrance-free shampoo for two days. My hair is what smells now--or maybe it always was the problem. Maybe there were two problems--my hair and scalp. I started using conditioner on my hair when I realized it made the shampoo smell less strong.
There is something odd in that today, my scalp was slightly itchy and flaky the way it used to be before the smell started. Maybe it was hormonal, and I'm going back to normal. It's been 2 1/2 weeks since I stopped using the Nuvaring. Or maybe my hair was so stripped of moisture, I needed to condition my hair every day until it's back to normal. I find it weird in that I can actually TASTE the smell of my hair.
After thinking about ions and things like that, I came across articles on chlorine allergies on the Internet search engines. Since my water is fluorinated and chlorinated, I wonder if that's what's causing some people to have these problems. They sell shower filters. I'm considering buying one to check it out.
http://servibiz.com/products/water/shower.htm
Oh, well, I'll keep updating since I'm sure someone out there is dealing with a similar problem. Maybe my posts will help someone else as all of the posts here help me find more information on this mysterious problem.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
Betsy
10.10.2007, 16:34
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
Hey, you may have something there about flouride in water. Ours has flouride also, which I voted against but it won out anyway. I do use toothpaste with no flouride. I take offense that things like that are forced upon the public like that. If someone wants to take flouride tablets, let them do it. My scalp problem started after they put flouride in our tap water.
Anyway, I do always use a conditioner and maybe that is why I don't notice the sulfur odor from the Jason Dandruff. I use Jason Jojoba conditioner and it has a nice clean smell, not strong but clean and nice.
Do keep everyone posted...I love to hear people share what is working for them.
Betsy is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
13.10.2007, 15:18
@ Betsy
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unscented products |
http://www.earthclinic.com/CURES/birth_control_pill_side_effects.html
Oh, my gosh. Finally, all my searching around the Internet helped me. So I was reading about the androgenic effects of various birth control methods. Supposedly, the NuvaRing does have some androgenic properties. I wondered why I gained so much weight within the 1st month of using the NuvaRing. Then when I went to Mexico and swam around in chlorine, I had this hair smell problem after returning home.
This article explains that chlorinated water and other heavy metals initiate dandruff. No wonder I didn't have this problem at my boyfriend's house--he has well water which contains no chemicals--but my own city water has chlorine.
Ahhh... so that's why I had such a problem. I also noticed that the smell is sometimes coming from my whole body--a sickly sweet odor characteristic of fasting (ketoacidosis)--and synthetic birth control hormones do affect your metabolism.
So everything seems to come right back to the NuvaRing. Ketoacidosis from the synthetic hormone wreaking havoc on my metabolism, my scalp smelling from the dandruff caused by the synthetic hormone, and my hair smelling metallic from the chlorine.
After I control the dandruff and moisturize my hair with heavy conditioners, I should be able to control the ketoacidosis when my hormones regulate--soon I hope! Finally, I have an answer. I hope this thread helps everyone else. My scalp and hair smell a little better every day, but until the NuvaRing wears off, this is a horrible nightmare to go to work and school with everyone wishing that you weren't there because you smell.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
25.10.2007, 13:52
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
Wow, so it's been 4 weeks and 3 days since I have stopped using the NuvaRing. I actually smelled normal for the past two days. I am going through less ketoacidosis since my weight has normalized and stayed stable. I saw a post about Home Health anti-dandruff shampoo which seemed to contain a lot of the ingredients that was recommended in the article that I posted above. Plus it was unscented. That was what sold me. I've been using Home Health shampoo for 4 days now.
Previously, I bought UltraSwim shampoo to strip chlorine from my hair, but I used it only once. Nizoral A-D made my hair smell like ammonia, so I used it only a couple times. I started drinking chlorella drinks to combat the chlorine. I switched to Tom's of Maine unscented deodorant to make sure that I wasn't smelling metallic like before. I also noted that I seemed to have yeast on my tongue--a mild thrush infection--so I brushed my tongue vigorously and used Crest Pro Heath mouthwash. Wow, I definitely had the beginnings of a yeast infection in my mouth. Dark blue strings of either bacteria or yeast clumped up and came out when I spat out the mouthwash. No wonder I tasted metal often. It was the yeast in my mouth. I thought I could actually taste the smell of my hair. The stress I was under must have caused a huge yeast infection--on my scalp, on my tongue, possibly in my intestinal tract as well since I was having digestive problems. Now I seem to be OK. No more weird smells filling up the whole room, choking people.
So now I am wondering what the problem is. If I switch from Home Health to another shampoo, will the smell come back? Was it only hormonal, and I can now use any shampoo? Or was it a fragrance conflict, and I must use only unscented products? Or was it really an SLS problem? Has anyone experimented and found out?
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
nax
31.10.2007, 23:53
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
Wow I just wrote up a super long reply, only to have it deleted before I could post  Whats up with this site!
anyway, in a nutshell, I had been using an SLS free shampoo for about 10 months now (with added tea tree oil - a natural antibacterial) and that seemed to have really helped with my scalp odour, which was previously so bad that I had someone come up to me once and mention it to me in front of a group of people . But until recently, I have noticed my head becoming smelly again. This may be because I'v been having some digestional problems recently, which could have caused some kind of fluctuation in the bacteria/fungus that produce the odour, like you mentioned. I really hope this is the case, but other possibilities include the fungus/bacteria becoming immune to the tea tree oil in my shampoo.
I also notice that the smell gets worse when I become socially anxious or paranoid, which is just ironic because thats what it makes me get like when I'm sitting in a classroom full of people.
Anyway, if my odour gets under control again quite soon then I will know it was only back temporarily and it was probably due to this maldigestion phase I was going through. I hope this theory turns out to be true.
PS The papers you found on scalp odour are really great. well done
nax is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
04.11.2007, 13:31
@ nax
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unscented products |
Yeah, this site times you out if you write a long reply. That has happened to me a couple times, so now I select the whole text and copy it before posting. That way, if I'm timed out, I just paste the whole post back in. Or you could write it first on a word processing program.
I was never really convinced that it's the SLS to begin with. Although SLS is drying, that itself wouldn't necessarily cause the odor. Hopefully, it's the digestive problem that you mentioned. As my doctor told me, diet is the most important factor in the way you smell. Perhaps your digestive problems have to do with your cycle? I know that during that period when I was smelling bad, I had constant diarrhea for more than a month. Now that I'm off the NuvaRing, my stool is normal.
I also noticed that when I'm stressed out, I feel like everyone is talking about how I smell since that's how it all started. I just rub my nose, take a deep breath, tell myself it's all imagined, and the smell is gone. At this point, it's paranoia for me. The real smell disappeared after my normal cycle started, after I finished the NuvaRing hormones.
This weekend I experimented to see what would happen if I tried the Jason shampoo. Smelled a little like sulfur, although not as bad as the first time I tried it. I just couldn't take the smell of the shampoo on my head. For whatever reason, my natural scent combined with the shampoo fragrance was horrible for me. Even though I used an unscented shampoo the following day, there is still a bit of the medicinal Jason shampoo smell, so I am beginning to suspect that I react horribly to certain fragrances. I'll try another experiment next weekend to see what happens with other shampoos and fragrances.
I also realized that when this weird smell started, I began washing my scalp thoroughly twice in the shower. My hair was already fried from swimming, and then I was drying out my scalp. My skin was drier from the birth control hormones--I have very oily skin--and to top it off, everything I did was drying out the skin. I think my skin needed moisture. The yeast probably proliferated due to the dryness of the skin since normally it's more oily. After I went off the NuvaRing, the texture of my skin and hair changed. My skin became extremely oily--like an oil slick--until it regulated back to a somewhat normal oiliness, the way it was before the NuvaRing. My hair became thinner and softer, rather than the thick and coarse texture while I was on birth control. Also my scalp became oiler, but I had lots of new hair growth to replace the hair that I lose. I now recall that I did not lose much hair while I was on the NuvaRing. Now I am losing hair, although it's a normal amount. (Average hair loss is about 100 strands per day.)
The point I'm trying to make is that perhaps the smell is coming from the dryness of the skin. Since my skin is normally oily, drying it out makes the skin work harder to replace the natural oils. Maybe moisturizing the scalp keeps the skin from oiling up. Someone said that coconut oil worked for someone. I'm just wondering if we have naturally oily skin, and things were OK for a long time, and then all of a sudden we had this weird smell event, was it because we dried out our skin, and as a result, the yeast took over our scalp? Who knows? I am just trying to search for an answer, and I know that my situation was caused by the birth control. The NuvaRing affected my skin by drying it out, and it also affected my metabolism, so the smells seem to have something in common with either oily skin going dry or metabolism.
Anyone out there have any other comments on how the smell seemed to have started?
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
nax
04.11.2007, 16:09
(edited by nax, 04.11.2007, 16:22)
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
Hey SBayGirl,
From what I gathered, smelly scalp conditions can be caused by one of two things: a fungal or bacterial infection, and in some cases both.
Signs of a yeast infection: dryness, flaking of the skin.
You mentioned that you thought you were drying out your skin, but it may have been signs of a yeast infection.
You also mentioned you were washing your hair twice a day. This is how an SLS based shampoo can provide the conditions for a yeast infection:
Using an SLS based shampoo:
"SLS does more than strip the hair of its natural oils. It removes beneficial bacteria that are essential to maintaining a healthy scalp and head of hair. Once the "good" bacteria have been vanquished, harmful germs have an open playing field, resulting in rashes, hair loss and allergic reactions"
[http://morroccomethod.com/article7.shtml]
Maintaing normal yeast levels:
"Candida yeasts are usually present in most people, but uncontrolled multiplication resulting in disease symptoms is kept in check by other naturally occurring microorganisms, e.g., bacteria co-existing with the yeasts in the same locations, and by the human immune system."
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candidiasis]
By washing your hair twice a day, you may have killed off good bacteria in your hair and allowed a yeast fungus to takeover.
A yeast infection named seborrhoeic dermatitis:
"The areas of the body that tend to be affected are where there are the most skin glands which make the sebum. Therefore the condition mainly affects the more 'greasy' areas of the skin such as the scalp, the forehead and the central parts of the face...mild patches of flaky skin may develop on the face"
[http://www.patient.co.uk/showdoc/23068977/]
Again this is referring to the dryness you may have experienced.
I havent come across anything saying that this yeast infection produces odour but I think there is a lot of ambiguity by describing odours as symptoms. A lot of people on this forum have gone to doctors and dermatologists with their smelly scalp condition only to be told there was no odour and that they were being paranoid, which just shows that odours are subject to a varied opinion and not classed as real syptoms a lot of the time.
I'm pretty sure the cause of my condition is a fungal infection, but please remember that I'm not a doctor or anything, and your condition might be quite different.
Possible treatment of yeast infection (although I think anyone using products with these types of ingredients should be very careful):
"An antifungal (anti-yeast) shampoo such as ketoconazole 2% is used to treat the scalp, eyebrows and other hairy areas. This kills the yeast germ and the skin then usually returns to normal. Use the shampoo 2-3 times a week (and use normal shampoo the rest of the time). Leave the shampoo on for about five minutes before rinsing off...
A 'normal' anti-dandruff shampoo that contains zinc pyrithione or coal tar may clear dandruff in mild cases if used regularly."
[http://www.patient.co.uk/showdoc/23068977/]
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Betsy
04.11.2007, 20:13
@ nax
|
unscented products |
OK, here's my take on things...good replies from you both on this. I think hormones play a role in this.
When I first noticed the smell I had been coloring my hair. This dries the scalp out. Plus with SLS products my hair was really getting dried out as SLS does not agree with me at all. I use the example of how my hands get cracked and dry and infected when I use SLS dishwashing liquid. I just know how my skin reacts to it PERIOD! Plus the hair dye made it worse. I have other yeast problems as I have a couple of toenails that have a fungal problem. Plus I know I get staff infections with an occasional boil. I treat this with Clindamycin gel when I get them. I think the SLS would leave my scalp in a run down, vulnerable state as I washed my hair daily. It is my opinion that all of these factors combined to let a staff-fungal infection into my scalp. The only thing that seemed to help me was the Jason Dandruff shampoo as it has both an anti-fungal and anti-bacterial element to it.
I wonder if this leads to a MRSA type of scalp condition. I agree that once you have the fungal problem it needs to be treated long term and this is why you use the shampoo (Jason dandruff) exclusively for 2 weeks (according to the bottle) and then once a week or so for maintenance. This seems to work well for me. I was needing to use it exclusively for a month or so just lately and now I'm able to once again use it alternately with another SLS free shampoo. To keep things under control.
Nax, maybe you were becoming immune to the tea tree oil for using it all the time? I don't know, everyone is different, but maybe once this is under control again you can start using the tea tree formula maybe every other time or something.
I'm afraid of losing the post so I will close this out...
Betsy is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
Betsy
04.11.2007, 20:30
@ Betsy
|
unscented products |
I would like to know if anyone else has a problem with any staff or yeast anywhere else but their scalp. I had been to 2 different doctors and they both prescribed worthless prescription shampoos plus antibiotics for my scalp and none of them worked...and both doctors didn't know what else could be done for me. Others on this forum have also gone to doctors and had no results to speak of.
SBayGirl I do think you are right when you say hormones play a role. I know they play a role in skin oil. So our scalps get oilier with our hormone cycle. Oil brings with it bacteria. This just magnifies the bacterial problem with our scalps. And SLS dries the scalp and skin out. At least with mine it does. This is why I like the SLS free shampoos. Have you tried other ones out other than the Jason Dandruff?
I am so glad you are here to brainstorm about this with me. If we all put our heads together we just may be able to figure out what helps everyone. We all seem to be making headway in one way or another.
Did anyone else use hair color? Has anyone else been wondering about this staff resistant MRSA bacteria and the scalp problem?
Betsy is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
05.11.2007, 15:27
@ nax
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unscented products |
I agree that both bacteria and yeast can cause odor. (Yeast is classified as a fungus for some reason.) My scalp actually dried out AFTER I stopped using the NuvaRing. It was not flaky or dry before. It was actually normal during the time I was using the birth control hormones. (Normal meaning not dry or oily.) My hands and my arms were extremely dry which is not normal for me. Now my hands are still dry, but my arms are normal. My scalp is oily, which is normal for me.
I was washing my hair twice in the shower. You know, rinse and repeat. Funny thing was I noticed that when I went out of town two weekends ago, I didn't bring any special shampoos. I used the hotel shampoo. Rather than working the shampoo thoroughly through my scalp, I merely sudsed up the hair and gave it a good rinse. I did not encounter any smells from that weekend, although I am not sure if there is any SLS in the hotel shampoo. I did definitely eat well during that time.
I do think sometimes the odor might have been coming from the grease on my face, but as my hormones have regulated, my face is no longer as greasy as before when I was waiting to have my first period without the NuvaRing. So perhaps I was smelling something that was right under my nose. Strange in that it feels like I'm experiencing puberty again.
Nizoral A-D made my hair smell like ammonia, so I might use it for weekly treatments on the weekend, but definitely not during the week. I'm not sure if I'll need it now since I'm pretty sure my condition was hormonal. I normally wash my hair every day, but I tried going without one day on the weekend. Although I didn't have the foul smell of before, I smelled like someone who needed to wash her hair--a NORMAL smell rather than an abnormal one. That made me quite content.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
05.11.2007, 16:15
@ Betsy
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unscented products |
I wondered if I had yeast on my tongue. Strange that I did not end up with yeast where women usually have it! There has been a lot of press on MRSA, but supposedly, hot water and soap usually is the best way to prevent spreading it. I drank chlorella drinks and ate yogurt to try to control yeast and bacteria.
I think my paranoia had something to do with it. I would work myself up into extreme stress, which probably caused me to sweat and bring out the foul smells in class or at work. Whenever a stranger approached me, I'd freak out, thinking, "Do I smell?" Sometimes the smells were not from me, but someone else who might have a similar problem. Thinking that the smells were from me would cycle into even more stress.
Hormones definitely do play a part in this. Hormones affect our moods, our sweat, and our oils. That's why I wonder if the drying out of our skins causes the smells. If you think of a sponge, it soaks up everything. That's why I thought about fragrance. If there is a strong fragrance, our skins might soak up the fragrance like a sponge. That's why I tried unscented products first. Right now I'm using the Home Health dandruff shampoo someone on this board recommended. It's unscented and SLS-free. The hotel shampoo I used was also unscented. I have no idea if it's SLS-free.
I am glad that people are here to think over this problem, too. We have to remember that doctors don't know everything because we might be suffering from long-term effects from products that were originally considered safe. The SLS might be the problem. Chlorination or fluorination of our water might the problem. Fragrance might be the problem. The problem is that until huge amounts of people are affected, everyone else is in the dark. Maybe it's all hormonal. Who knows?
I don't use hair color anymore. I haven't in a long time. Again, that might be drying out your skin, which opens up breaks for bacterial infection if it's really dry. I'm not a doctor either, but I do have a bachelors in genetics. They are actually lots of people who had a disease who educated themselves and discovered things without even a science degree, like the parents in the true-life movie Lorenzo's Oil. Don't let that stop you from finding answers to this mysterious problem.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
Betsy
05.11.2007, 17:47
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
Hey, I know the smell you are talking about! I get it now after going 2 days without washing my hair...just an oily normal smell! How delightful!!!  The Aubrey Organics and Jason Jojoba shampoos are nearly unscented so when I need to wash it leaves a NORMAL oily smell.
Yes, I do believe hormones play a huge role in this because they cause excess oiliness.
This is great to have others to brainstorm with.
I am not going to color my hair anymore. Not worth the risk. It does irritate my scalp enough to let in bacteria. My husband says I look like Emmilou Harris now!  That's OK...I'll take that any day if it avoids the smelly stuff.
I was thinking that it is strange that when you were on the Nuvaring your oiliness was normal? But it made your scalp smell? Hmm....you will have to clarify this for me. I'm not sure I was reading you right on that one.
Betsy is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
06.11.2007, 13:15
@ Betsy
|
unscented products |
» I was thinking that it is strange that when you were on the Nuvaring your
» oiliness was normal? But it made your scalp smell? Hmm....you will have
» to clarify this for me. I'm not sure I was reading you right on that one.
Well, oiliness of my scalp is normal for me. If I go a day without washing, my hair gets very oily. Three days, and my hair is extremely oily, which is why I wash every day. On the NuvaRing, my scalp and face dried out. I had normal skin instead of oily skin. That's why some teenage girls take birth control--to solve acne problems. Birth control dries out the skin so that acne goes away.
I continued to wash every day because that was my routine. When I went swimming in Mexico, I washed twice a day because I was washing out the chlorine, so it must have freaked out my scalp with the birth control hormones, chlorine, and constant washing.
Now that I'm back to my oily skin, the smell went away. So I wonder if the yeast proliferates on drier skin? Maybe it was bacteria? Since I pump out so much oil on my skin, I probably wash out the bacteria or yeast from the pores with the oils. That's the protective factor of oil, anyways. My natural balance of yeast and bacteria on my skin was probably restored. Skin should be moist so that there aren't any breaks to let in bacteria.
Maybe that's why the smell stopped, or maybe it was more due to stress and hormones. When we stress out, we pump out hormones through the air. That's why animals can smell fear on us. Most of us can't smell those types of hormones, but maybe our stress is causing us to smell terribly. The problem is to lower stress, and when you stress out about how you smell after an incident has already occurred, it's tough to break that fear cycle. It took me a while to get over it, and now I realize that some of the smells that I now think I'm smelling are imagined. It might be slight smells that only I can smell since I'm so paranoid. It will probably take me another month to get over my paranoia since it took about a month for the synthetic hormones to break down.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
28.01.2008, 15:44
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
So I have been using the unscented dandruff shampoo, which has helped to an extent, but now my problem is that when my hair is damp, the hair shampoo has a stronger scent when wet until my hair dries. The "unscented" shampoo has a slight scent which becomes stronger on me when my hair is wet. Once it dries, I'm OK. I have been off the NuvaRing for a while now, and the effects are going away slowly. My weird smell has been fading, so I'm very sure that it's hormone-related. My hair has started growing in normally now--I used to have new hair growth stick out from my head so that I had to smooth the tufts down. On the NuvaRing, my hair didn't seem to grow much. It was thick, but didn't really grow.
Then I watched a Friends episode in which the character Phoebe says that 90% of a woman's hormones are emitted from the top of her head. That's why women are shorter, so that a man falls in love with a woman as he hugs her by sniffing her hair. Well, even if it's true or not true, that got me thinking. I searched on the Internet and found this.
http://www.anapsid.org/pheromones.html
I was always the alpha-female in that my roommates cycles were affected by my mine. I wonder if we are all alpha-females, and our hormones are being disrupted by our environments in some way. In any case, I have started taking showers at night to make sure that my hair is dry by the time I go to work. I also noticed that some soaps or laundry fabric softeners leave an unpleasant smell. Costco's brand of Kirkland fabric softener is horrible. So is Jergen's hand soap.
I still think it has something to do with pheromones, hormones, and fragrance. I am not sure about the other factors like SLS. The dandruff shampoo didn't have SLS, and I still started smelling faintly. Not as bad as when I was still using the NuvaRing, though, thank God. I think it has to do with the way my body reacts to particular smells. It all seems to go right back to hormones as a cause.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
12.03.2008, 21:13
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
OK, so I have continued to post in my thread on unscented products just in case someone has the same situation as me--a smell after beginning the use of a birth control product. In my case, I was using the NuvaRing for 15 months when the smell developed.
Yesterday, I had the weirdest smell--sulfurous gas emitting from my head like rotten eggs.  I am not sure if it was me or the diesel car that I borrowed from my mother while my car was in the shop for the day. If the diesel was smelly from not driving it for long distances as my boyfriend says can happen, the smell clung to me for a long time and emitted the gas several times. I then googled to see if there was something about wet hair that clings to external smells and came up with this weird but related link:
http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/18072
So it might be that the smelly diesel fuel was the reason why my hair was emitted sulfur gas. It has not happened today, so I guess that's what happened. I am using a different shampoo today, though. I doubt if that's the issue since I have used that shampoo several times without that happening before.
I have noticed that my smell has changed to a weird scent, so I am going to switch soaps again. I think I am reacting to bar soaps. It might be the pH of the soap that causes that weird smell. I was doing well on Dove unscented, but I switched to another soap that I already had. It didn't seem to make a difference at first, but maybe that's the reason why I am having a weird smell.
The other interesting smell that has developed is a masculine cologne smell.  It's actually not horrible, but weird in that it's coming from my sweat. I normally don't have much of a smell from my sweat, even if I don't use deodorant. I'm using Tom's Natural Unscented Deodorant now. I keep thinking that the masculine scent has to do with pheromones and hormones. Why? Because it's not really an ODOR. If I sniff around myself, it's not an actual smell. I smell clean. But there's this other scent, which I suspect is a pheromone, that smells like a guy. I must be emitting some weird breakdown product of the synthetic hormone from the NuvaRing. So I searched around to find these two websites, which are actually related.
http://www.thefinalclub.org/blogs/fall2007/SciB47/?p=25
"The small molecule pheromone in female moths is bombykol. It’s so potent that if a single female moth released all of the bombykol in her sac in a single spray, she could theoretically attract a trillion males in that instant."
So maybe the weird synthetic hormones were being broken down into a strange pheromone that others detect and repulse them instead of attracting them as usual? 
http://www.drnorthrup.com/news/sexdrive.php
"Birth control pills are comprised of potent synthetic estrogens (for example, ethinyl estradiol) and synthetic progestins (for example, norethindrone) that diminish the levels of follicle stimulating hormones (FSH) and luteinizing hormone (LH), two pituitary hormones. This results in the metabolic suppression of ovarian function, including both the suppression of ovulation and testosterone production!
"In addition, OCs also cause a marked increase in the production of sex hormone binding globulin (SHBG) in the liver. (This is the main binding protein for sex steroids.) The higher the SHBG levels, the more hormones are 'bound' and unavailable for biologic effects on tissues. In the recent study on the pill’s effect on testosterone, researchers found that SHBG levels were four times higher in pill users than in those who had never used the pill. This means that although a woman taking OCs produces testosterone in her body, it’s unavailable for normal uses such as stimulating her sex drive.
"Even more worrisome is that SHBG levels remained elevated in women for at least six months after they stopped taking the pill, after which the study was concluded. No one knows how long this effect lasts, but researchers are concerned that prolonged exposure to synthetic hormones induces gene-imprinted and increased gene expression of SHBG in the liver in some women who have used the pill."
Remember that I said that I smelled like a man? Since the hormones do have an affect on metabolism, and the pill affects the testosterone in a woman's body, my body must be making more testosterone because the SHBG levels are keeping the testosterone from being used for sex drive...and it's been 6 months since I stopped the NuvaRing.
My hope is that my body will revert back to its normal state after a full year, but who knows what will happen. I just know that my odor continues to change as my body breaks down the synthetic hormones. I really do think it's pheromones that people are smelling in my case, especially since not everyone can smell the scent. The majority can, but a minority can't smell a thing...and those who are closest to me can't smell it at all, which suggests pheromones.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
12.03.2008, 22:31
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
http://solework.wordpress.com/2007/06/11/pheromones/
I forgot to add this about pheromones being released from the scalp.
"The tiny glands that release this personal scent are scattered all over your body - your face, nipples, anal and genital regions, armpits, ears, eyelids, and scalp."
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
17.03.2008, 12:59
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
I have been noticing other changes with my body. I notice that I produce a lot of sweat from my scalp, and my hair absorbs it. When I was on the NuvaRing, my body did not produce much sweat or oil. Now that my body is beginning to revert back to its normal state, I'm producing more sweat and oils. My hair is starting to become less dry. It is actually shiny like it used to be. What a dramatic change. My skin is moisturized instead of dry. My sex drive is actually coming back.
I am now convinced it was hormonal. The smells were definitely coming from my sweat. I suspect that the NuvaRing dried out my body so that any scented shampoo, soap, or body lotion was absorbed internally, metabolized, and then came out of my sweat or oils via the pores. My scent has now changed from the weird masculine cologne scent to a sickly sweet smell--the ketoacidosis smell that I complained about previously. It's not as strong as it was when I first noticed my problem. I am losing weight since the synthetic hormone is now almost out of my system. The first month that I was on the NuvaRing, I immediately gained 10 lbs. I gained a total of 15 lbs. I have now lost 10 lbs so far. I hope that by another two months I will be able to say that the smell is finally gone and that I'm back to my original weight.
I will check with my regular doctor to see if I am a carrier for TMAU (only one gene as opposed to both genes for TMAU), and ask for an appointment with an endocrinologist if the smell continues. I'm waiting on my appointment with my GYN to report my weird condition on this NuvaRing. I doubt that he will believe my story, but we'll see. I'll keep up on my reports in case others have a case similar to mine.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
31.03.2008, 21:51
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
Well, I went to my GYN, and he was doubtful that the NuvaRing would cause a smell, yet I recall seeing that another woman had problems with body odors with hormonal birth control somewhere on the Internet. He was surprised, saying that it's a much lower dosage than the Pill, but that doesn't help ME since my body went crazy on this and the last birth control pill that I tried. I am never taking another estrogen and/or progesterone pill, IUD, ring, patch, etc. again. 
Today I did not have a masculine cologne smell.  Instead I smelled like...a baby. Do you know what I mean when a baby that has been sleeping and sweating? They smell faintly powdery from the talcum powder? So the smell keeps changing as the hormones begin to fade away. A friend suggested a liver cleanse. I am going to look into it. She took it when she was taking some sort of steroid medication.
I keep changing various shampoos. The 356 brand unscented shampoo doesn't smell very pleasant on me. I think I'll stick to the other ones that I have. Maybe I'll even try a scented shampoo to see what happens as an experiment.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
02.04.2008, 23:53
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
The smell came back today. I overheard someone saying, "She smells like trash." It really does sound like TMAU from the comments that I hear. I did get a whiff every once in a while, but most of the time, I didn't smell it. Why can others smell it, but not me? When I did smell it, it did smell a bit like how trash can smell. I smelled faint notes of banana or something fruity.
I felt very discouraged, considering the day before I overheard someone say, "The smell is gone!" What happened was, today was the 1st day of my period.
I know that metabolism is tied into the menstrual cycle in some way. Sometimes I'm constipated during my period. Other times, I have diarrhea...which is why I'm still pondering over why this NuvaRing seems to cause me to smell when I did not have problems before. I am encouraged in that the smell doesn't seem to travel around the room like it did before when it was at its worst. I saw people holding their noses when I was at my worst. Now the smell seems to cling closer to me rather than diffusing around the room. It's no longer like a gas that I'm emitting, but I definitely have an odor from my sweat. When I don't eat, it's a sweet odor that I emit.
I think I'm going to have to go back to my doctor for an appointment for an endocrinologist. I suspect that it will go away once my period is over if I am reacting to the synthetic hormones, but I am tired of just waiting it out. I'm going into 7 months since stopping the use of NR, but the side effect continues on.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
nax
03.04.2008, 20:24
@ SBayGirl
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unscented products |
Hey SBay,
sorry to hear that, some days are just crap days . I would definitely get tested for TMAU if I were you, apparantly its just a simple urine sample you can send off in the post. Monell Chemical Senses can do it if you live in the States. Visit www.monell.org. Hope you're not feeling too down.
» The smell came back today. I overheard someone saying, "She smells like
» trash." It really does sound like TMAU from the comments that I hear. I
» did get a whiff every once in a while, but most of the time, I didn't
» smell it. Why can others smell it, but not me? When I did smell it, it did
» smell a bit like how trash can smell. I smelled faint notes of banana or
» something fruity.
» I felt very discouraged, considering the day before I overheard someone
» say, "The smell is gone!" What happened was, today was the 1st day of my
» period.
»
» I know that metabolism is tied into the menstrual cycle in some way.
» Sometimes I'm constipated during my period. Other times, I have
» diarrhea...which is why I'm still pondering over why this NuvaRing seems
» to cause me to smell when I did not have problems before. I am encouraged
» in that the smell doesn't seem to travel around the room like it did
» before when it was at its worst. I saw people holding their noses when I
» was at my worst. Now the smell seems to cling closer to me rather than
» diffusing around the room. It's no longer like a gas that I'm emitting,
» but I definitely have an odor from my sweat. When I don't eat, it's a
» sweet odor that I emit.
»
» I think I'm going to have to go back to my doctor for an appointment for
» an endocrinologist. I suspect that it will go away once my period is over
» if I am reacting to the synthetic hormones, but I am tired of just waiting
» it out. I'm going into 7 months since stopping the use of NR, but the side
» effect continues on.
nax is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
10.04.2008, 12:22
@ nax
|
unscented products |
» Hey SBay,
» sorry to hear that, some days are just crap days . I would definitely
» get tested for TMAU if I were you, apparantly its just a simple urine
» sample you can send off in the post. Monell Chemical Senses can do it if
» you live in the States. Visit www.monell.org. Hope you're not feeling
» too down.
Thanks, Nax. I am starting to wonder if there is a smell at all now. I was talking to someone, and she sits near me in class. Even when I thought there was a terrible smell, she says she smelled nothing at all. To be honest, whenever I have a face-to-face conversation with people about this, they all say that they have never detected a smell. Only when people are out of my sight do I hear things. So the question is, am I hallucinating smells and becoming so paranoid that I imagine people talking about me? Or was there really a smell initially, but it's gone now, and I continue to imagine it?
I looked up imaginary smells and came up with stuff like phantosmia and parosmia.
http://personal.ecu.edu/wuenschk/parosmia.htm
Doesn't that sound like the complaints we see here? I wonder if the NuvaRing caused parosmia for me. As the drug wears off, it's been tapering down. Many pregnant women imagine smells as well, so it really makes me wonder if there was a smell at all. So that brings another avenue of possibilities.
1. real smells caused by hormonal changes
2. real smells caused by TMAU
3. imaginary smells caused by depression or schizoprenia
4. imaginary smells caused by drug side effect
5. imaginary smells caused by brain tumor
6. imaginary smells caused by epilepsy
Now that I have gotten the courage to speak to a number of people about "my smell," I realize that each one that I speak to insists that there is no smell.
I kept thinking about TMAU, and I wonder if I could be a carrier since I used to eat eggs, meat, and fish without any problems before. I think it's best to see an endocrinologist and rule out TMAU and hormone levels before moving down to the possibility of imaginary smells. I am going to check with another person that took classes with me during the time that I thought that I had a terrible smell, and she what she says. Hopefully, she'll be honest.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
13.04.2008, 00:19
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
I asked a guy that I know, and he said that he smelled nothing, although he admitted that his sense of smell wasn't so good. So I'm guessing that it was a weird olfactory hallucination created by the NuvaRing.
http://www.primarypsychiatry.com/aspx/articledetail.aspx?articleid=756
"It has been known for some time that puerperal and menstrual psychoses are likely associated with hormonal fluctuations in women. Peripheral estrogen modulates dopaminergic transmission,1 with at least one hypothesis implicating estrogen withdrawal as an etiology of psychosis.2 Indirect evidence for this theory was noted in the November 1999 “Psychopharmacology Journal Watch” column with a case report of a woman with no previous psychiatric history, in whom psychosis appeared after discontinuation of an oral contraceptive.3"
The more I searched for hormones and hallucinations on the Internet, the more I found. I have an appointment with my doctor for a referral for an endocrinologist. Hopefully, I can at least rule out TMAU.
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
SBayGirl
25.06.2008, 01:18
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products |
Wow. I just reread all the stuff that I wrote, and it seems like a bad dream. I don't have this problem any more. It was definitely from the NuvaRing. I am totally normal again. Bizarre.
All I can say is that I don't think I have TMAU unless I am a carrier. My doctor was quite unhelpful. Another doctor mentioned that Asian women metabolize very slowly, so maybe that's why it took so long for the NuvaRing side effects to go away?
There was definitely a smell that built up and then went away. I no longer smell anything unusual. I also think that the synthetic progesterone was the culprit. I think it made me paranoid. I must have imagined the smells or was super-sensitive to smells. I no longer freak out if I smell anything.
This does make me worry about pregnancies in my future. I have never been pregnant, so if birth control which similates pregnancy makes me this crazy, what's going to happen to me when I am pregnant and go into labor? I really worry about postpartum psychosis. What if I'm the next Andrea Yates?
SBayGirl is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: NO |
Mz Bea
27.10.2008, 12:19
@ SBayGirl
|
unscented products(To SBayGirl) |
Dear SBayGirl-- I will be honest and tell you that my doc had to Rx me a stress med to help alleviate the "sensing" of the odors. My nose was just like a dogs! Highly sensitive!! Anytime I smell anything, I thought it was me... whether it was or not. What ever this thing is... hormonal, bacterial/fungal, viral, or psychological(including evn if caused by neuro and excito toxic origins)....it definitely heightens the detection and sensing of the odors! I know how you feel, Babe! --Miz Bea
==============================================================================
» Wow. I just reread all the stuff that I wrote, and it seems like a bad
» dream. I don't have this problem any more. It was definitely from the
» NuvaRing. I am totally normal again. Bizarre.
»
» All I can say is that I don't think I have TMAU unless I am a carrier. My
» doctor was quite unhelpful. Another doctor mentioned that Asian women
» metabolize very slowly, so maybe that's why it took so long for the
» NuvaRing side effects to go away?
»
» There was definitely a smell that built up and then went away. I no longer
» smell anything unusual. I also think that the synthetic progesterone was
» the culprit. I think it made me paranoid. I must have imagined the smells
» or was super-sensitive to smells. I no longer freak out if I smell
» anything.
»
» This does make me worry about pregnancies in my future. I have never been
» pregnant, so if birth control which similates pregnancy makes me this
» crazy, what's going to happen to me when I am pregnant and go into labor? I
» really worry about postpartum psychosis. What if I'm the next Andrea Yates?
Mz Bea is located in [NA] and he is available to meet: YES |
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